The social-media app’s executives Mike Lu and Ryan Kavanaugh talk their legal tussle with TikTok, the Trump-and-Microsoft saga, and what they believe sets their platform apart
Lu and Kavanaugh spoke with me about Triller’s growth, its legal tussle with TikTok, and how their platform stacks up to the one making headlines alongside Microsoft, Twitter, and the U.S. government.Ryan Kavanaugh:
Could we one day turn on advertising and add a couple billion dollars of revenue? Sure. But right now, our numbers are higher than any of our competitors. We’ll be [generating] a couple hundred million dollars and that’s without advertising.It means when people go on Triller and a song is played, it triggers a stream, which leads to money. We have a deal with Apple Music; it’s an integrated player. So the more people interact, the more artists make money.
How do you respond to the news circus happening in the US around TikTok, Trump, and Microsoft? And the narrative that an entrepreneurial, forward-thinking Chinese company is getting corporately bullied out of America?The first thing would be to talk about the irony; I’ve never seen anything like it. I can’t believe the press hasn’t picked it up. Virtually every major US company is banned from being in China — Google, Facebook, Instagram, you name it.
The only possible way we see something like this working is if [Microsoft] doesn’t actually buy the app: you buy the goodwill, you buy the name, but you use another app that looks, feels and acts like it. Then you rescan it and call it TikTok, and you tell everybody in the US, ‘Hey, by the way, re-download TikTok,’ after it’s taken off the App Store for an hour. So that what they’re downloading has all the same functionality and the same feel, but was never in China. Microsoft doesn’t have that.
We were already growing at a phenomenal rate prior to all this TikTok stuff. More than three months ago, before the ban was being talked about, some of the top TikTok influencers were coming in and saying, ‘We feel a responsibility to get off this app — we’ve done our own research.’ They started to onboard with us, and it’s grown out into hyper-speed. I can tell you, we’ve turned down offers from major tech, because we believe we’re in chapter two of chapter 20.
You have shareholders like Universal Music Group, Sony Music Group, Warner Music Group and Live Nation, plus artists like The Weeknd, Kendrick Lamar and Snoop Dogg, as well as leading artist managers. Why have you gone down the route of handing over minority ownership stakes to all of these music companies and individuals?We always wanted to made sure that we had an identity — why we exist. Social and short-form video, especially now, is a very crowded space.
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